Road v TT Cleat Set-Up

"Tad, I’m considering getting a second pair of road shoes dedicated to my TT rig. What do I need to do to find the optimal cleat positioning – how would it differ from the road setup?"

Lee,

These are great questions. Yes the setup on the 2nd set of shoes for TT/Tri may differ from your road shoes in several ways. Since the pelvis in the aero position is rotated forward and down the ischial tuberosities narrow and place more weight distribution on the pubic rami and perineum area. Therefore the stance width or "Q" factor may change since you are not sitting up and wide as in a road position, and canting levels may be less. You may desire a narrower stance to relieve tension of your abductors (inner thigh). What is becoming more normal in TT/TRI now is to look at placing the pedal farther back on the shoe (via speedplay extender plates) to put the axle underneath the knee more and deactivate the calf and reduce radial and axial forces (rolling)of the ankle foot relationship. This along with the correct arch support via a custom insole can create a more favorable torque profile perfect for steady state riding and in some cases can reduce hip and knee angles (and the distance they travel) that allows more aero positioning without a loss of power. Add a rotor ring with the correct phasing in the powerband for your most efficient sustainable power production.

There are several methods to finding the best case placement of the cleat, but you would need to quantify how much steady state versus undulation your riding entails (speed changes as well as terrain), as well as intensity and duration. If you were to graph power based on placement, the farther forward the cleat the higher the spike, whereas moving the cleat back creates a spike not quite as high as the forward position it is several times wider which means that the ability to sustain a high workload. The difference is the use of the foot as a rigid lever and the different muscular recruitment, especially the calf.

The old way of placing the center of the spindle under the ball of the foot has changed whereas the axle centerline is now advised to be between the junction of the 2nd and 5th toes at their respective bases. This was to reduce pressure on the bones of the foot. Besides the "ball of the foot" is usually 3cm due to the curvature and angle of the foot depending on toe up or toe down pedaling styles.

While you know I am happy to do this for you, here is the way I would advise you to baseline the cleat position. Keep in mind this is not addressing cant or orientation/rotation. Use your powermeter to determine at a set speed(kph)if you can drop a few watts out by fore/aft positioning from the baseline.

1. Sit on a table with bare feet. Have a partner mark the center line of the (side) of the ball of your foot with a pen while your feet are suspended. (The foot is often on an elevated position and not one of 90 degree dorsiflexion as in standing.)

2. Take a thumbtack (point bent over)and place longways over the penmark. Affix with tape.

3. Carefully slide your foot in the shoe. Have your partner feel and place a mark (on the outside of the shoe) on top of the thumbtack. It is best to continue it to the sole of the shoe. Chalk or a grease pencil/china markers works well. It is not abnormal to not have the lines match up from left to right due to variances in your feet.

4. Next set the cleat centerline behind the drawn line based on the below:

Shoe Size 36-38 7-9mm behind the line

Shoe Size 39-41 8-10mm behind the line

Shoe Size 42-43 11mm behind the line

Shoe Size 44-45 10-12mm behind the line

Shoe Size 46-47 11-14mm behind the line

Shoe Size 48-50 12-16mm behind the line




Try this out and let me know how it goes.




Website: www.tadhughescustom.com
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Online Question: "When fitting clients, what do you find the correlation is of saddle height and leg extension (at max)?"

Marc,

This is a great question and I would say drop it 2mm (about the width of a sharpie marker), but I urge you to look at it from another viewpoint. Instead of driving to a desired knee angle that is merely in the range, think of the knee angle as the end result of the pattern and angle of the foot at the top and bottom of the stroke after cleat placement, canting, and internal shoe support. We also have to consider the front to back (fore/aft) as the relationship between the knee over (plus or minus) the foot can affect timing as well as knee health. You have to think of the femur as a lever similar to a locomotive with the foot acting as a concentric in the connection. My clients are all put through a thorough flexibility and structural exam so I know ahead of time exactly what the limitations are, and you will definitely need to know the profile of the lower back and sacrum of that individual. 

Seat height can vary and be environmental.  Houston (Gulf Coast/flat) clients left to their own accord tend to gravitate towards an up and back position to make use of full extension of the leg from a position that is above and behind the pedal spindle. In most cases the knee angles will be high with the feet slightly toe down.  This footpath tends to resemble the shape of a vertical watermelon, where the emphasis is vertical extension into the stroke (think locomotive) and pulling up, with very little torque through the bottom half of the stroke. Main complaints are usually lower back and saddle issues. Austin (Hill Country) clients on the other hand tend to run slightly lower and forward since the need to have the foot in full contact through the bottom of the stroke with a slightly forward bias due to more climbing. Knees angles are usually lower here, but dependent if the client dorsiflexes pulling the foot flat through the bottom of the stroke.  The foot tracing here looks like a fat egg since the lower and forward saddle produces more torque through the bottom. Common issues are lower back, quads and hands since most folks are too short in their reach after moving the saddle forward to place the knee farther over the foot.

 In either case the knee angles will vary depending on the individual and their conditions but it is most important to listen to cues of what they want and where they feel that they need it most. You are just choosing different sides of the range depending on the goals of that person. The casual rider with an emphasis on comfort may want to be back and down to change the weight distribution to relieve pressure off their hands and the saddle interface is paramount. More performance oriented individuals may tend to trend on the higher side as weight distribution leans towards the front end more and even more so for triathlon. Hope all is well in Florida.  Enjoy the ride. 

Website: www.tadhughescustom.com

Twitter: @MasterBikeFit

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Your Bike Can Talk. Listen to it.

Your equipment and clothing has a story to tell, but what are they trying to say? Notice one side of the chamois becomes unstitched on every pair of shorts you own?  One side of the bar tape always seems to push away or a gel pocket on only one glove seems pummeled?  Only one side of something seems to be continually sore?

Cycling is a closed kinetic chain with only 5 points of contact for the normal rider and 7 contact points for a triathlete in which to distribute the body’s entire weight on the bike, all while moving.  Now consider the body’s weight distributed over those points but with a skeletal twist or a hip rotated forward. Would all the points continue to evenly bear the weight? In most cases, no, as the body will simply adapt; we’ve given it no other option. Take this concept into consideration in regard to time and intensity on the bicycle. Minor asymmetries typically show less bearing in shorter slower rides but can be debilitating over multiple hours or high intensity. 

While the causes can be various and far greater than my short list, here are a couple of things to look for, and fix, to get a little more comfortable on the bike.

1.       Saddle:

View from the back and side to ensure one side has not collapsed or is lower than the other, or that there is a bent seat rail and/or seat post issue. When viewing overhead is the saddle straight with the bike? Is the saddle straight but the nose twisted? Is there material worn or missing from one side?   Focus on wear patterns when looking overhead. Are there clues such as divots and if so are they even side to side?

2.       Pedals/Cleats:

If you can’t recall the last time you changed your cleats, it’s been too long, especially if you are a Look Delta/Keo user.  Always clearly mark the outline of your cleat by tracing them with a pen.  Start your cleat inspection by making sure the cleat is intact noticing any differences left vs. right.  It is normal to find accelerated wear on your dominant foot but too much will cause a change in the pedal gait of that leg since the material interface and proper engagement angle have changed.  Inspect the body of the pedal next, looking for gouges, irregular wear or any missing material. Don’t overlook bearing wear and bent axles.  Either of these two items can cause many problems if chronically neglected.

3.       Handlebar/Shifters:

I coupled these two pieces of equipment since they each contribute to different yet simultaneous issues.  First and foremost check to see that the wheel is straight with the frame. You will often notice it more while riding rather than standing over the bar. Overly worn bar tape on one side, calluses on the hand that do not match or worn rubber on the shifter are tell-tale signs that too much force is being exerted, or at least at the wrong angle. This is not limited to just the top of the bar but uneven, dirty or wear marks on the drops tell a story as well. It is best to use a wind-trainer or a repair stand to ensure your hoods are level.  Use a traditional level or measure each side from the tip of the saddle to the center of the horn of the hood.

Regular visual or measured inspection can be the best preventive maintenance for the health of your position and alleviate nagging or painful scenarios while riding.  By putting the pieces of the puzzle together based on these common signs, you can better understand the needs of what your body is trying to tell you on the bike. Enjoy the ride. 

Website: www.tadhughescustom.com

Twitter: @MasterBikeFit

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